Volume 40: Number 65
Thu, 29 Sep 2022
Subjects Discussed In This Issue:
Message: 1
From: Richard Wolberg
Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2022 11:45:53 -0400
Subject: [Avodah] Apple in Honey on R"H
I remember a sermon when I was a child asking why do we dip the apple in honey on R?H.
Why specifically honey as opposed to something else sweet?
The answer: the bee has to work hard to produce the honey and if you want a sweet year, it doesn?t just come automatically, but you have to work for it.
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Message: 2
From: Zev Sero
Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2022 11:49:15 -0400
Subject: Re: [Avodah] Sheqel Kesef
On 22/9/22 14:32, Micha Berger via Avodah wrote:
> On Wed, Sep 21, 2022 at 10:56:04PM +0300, Danny Schoemann via Avodah wrote:
>> If coins didn't exist when the Torah was given, and for many centuries
>> thereafter, how do we explain the Halocho of Chilul Maaser Sheini?
>> It needs a coin for Chilul. Even an Asimon (a blank coin) doesn't qualify.
> Is that specific requirement miSinai? Or is it a din derabbanan about
> how to be meqayeim the deOraisa? (Question isn't rhetorical.)
It *seems* on its surface to be mid'oraisa, because it's based on the
pasuk "vetzarta hakesef". But you seem to be suggesting that that's an
asmachta.
--
Zev Sero ?Were we directed from Washington when to sow
z...@sero.name and when to reap, we should soon want bread.?
?Thomas Jefferson: Autobiography, 1821.
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Message: 3
From: Micha Berger
Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2022 16:39:18 -0400
Subject: Re: [Avodah] Apple in Honey on R"H
On Sun, Sep 25, 2022 at 11:45:53AM -0400, Richard Wolberg via Avodah wrote:
> Why specifically honey as opposed to something else sweet?
> The answer: the bee has to work hard to produce the honey and if you
> want a sweet year, it doesn't just come automatically, but you have to
> work for it.
I heard another nice explanation...
Rav Meir Shapiro (Rosh Yeshiva Chakhmei Lublin, 1887-1933; the force
behind the launch of a global Daf Yomi) notes that bee honey is the only
food that is kosher yet comes from a non-kosher source. Honey can even
contain dissolved bee parts and still be kosher. This is due to a verse
that implies that honey is kosher (and reasoning about how bees don't
actually add to the nectar is post-facto explanation).
This property -- something permissible and tasty coming from something
prohibited -- makes it very representative of teshuvah.
Tir'u baTov!
-Micha
--
Micha Berger When memories exceed dreams,
http://www.aishdas.org/asp The end is near.
Author: Widen Your Tent - Rav Moshe Sherer
- https://amzn.to/2JRxnDF
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Message: 4
From: Akiva Miller
Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2022 21:18:26 -0400
Subject: Re: [Avodah] Sheqel Kesef
.
R' Danny Schoemann wrote (supporting my claim that coins must have been
around in Moshe Rabenu's time):
> If coins didn't exist when the Torah was given, and for many
> centuries thereafter, how do we explain the Halocho of Chilul
> Maaser Sheini?
> It needs a coin for Chilul. Even an Asimon (a blank coin)
> doesn't qualify.
R' Micha Berger responded:
> Is that specific requirement miSinai? Or is it a din
> derabbanan about how to be meqayeim the deOraisa? (Question
> isn't rhetorical.)
This is a fascinating Torah Temimah, on Devarim 14:25, number 61. Before I
go into what the Torah Temimah writes, I'd like to point out my personal
feeling that the phrase in that pasuk - "'v'tzarta hakesef b'yadcha - wrap
up the money/silver in your hand" - is a very unusual way to describe
monetary redemption. I always presumed that if the Torah is using such an
unusual term, then the insistence on kesef that has a tzura must be on the
d'Oraisa level. I may have been mistaken.
In the first paragraph, the Torah Temimah cites Rambam Hilchos Maaser Sheni
4:9, that the money must be a coin that has either a picture or writing.
This allowance for writing (even without a picture) leads me to suspect
that most gold bars would meet this criterion. (They would fail the "legal
tender" test nowadays, but might have been okay when the Machpela was
purchased.) Coins don't need to be circular, do they?
The second paragraph is more relevant to RMB's question. Torah Temimah
specifically mentions cases where maaser sheni "was redeemed, but was not
redeemed k'halacha, namely, that it was redeemed on an asimon."
This phrase - "redeemed but not redeemed k'halacha" - is startling to me.
Would we give any credence to "a shofar, but not a shofar k'halacha", or to
food that was "kosher, but not kosher k'halacha"? The only explanation I
can think of is that this maaser sheni, which was redeemed on an asimon, is
considered as redeemed on a d'Oraisa level, but a *not* redeemed on a
d'rabanan level. Further conjecture is above my level, and I invite the
chevra to discuss it.
Akiva Miller
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Message: 5
From: Joel Rich
Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2022 09:23:20 -0400
Subject: [Avodah] eulogy?
The gemara (Sanhedrin 47a) says it?s a good sign for the departed if they
are not properly eulogized (apparently it?s a ?punishment?). If so, why
don?t we see more people requesting they not be eulogized?
GCT
Joel Rich
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Message: 6
From: Micha Berger
Date: Wed, 28 Sep 2022 10:47:21 -0400
Subject: Re: [Avodah] Sheqel Kesef
On Sun, Sep 25, 2022 at 11:49:15AM -0400, Zev Sero via Avodah wrote:
>> Is that specific requirement miSinai? Or is it a din derabbanan about
>> how to be meqayeim the deOraisa? (Question isn't rhetorical.)
> It *seems* on its surface to be mid'oraisa, because it's based on the pasuk
> "vetzarta hakesef". But you seem to be suggesting that that's an asmachta.
Well, since I asked an explicitly non-rhetorical question, I most
suggested that *it is possible* it is an asmachta.
If it were proven archeologically that coins didn't exist when the
Torah was given, one could say that the gemara must have been giving
an asmachta. Okay, it is nearly impossible to prove something didn't
exist. (Barring a document from the royal court of Yehudah in an observant
period with a statement like "When we invented coins...") Still, it
makes the laws of pidyon maaser sheini less than a proof that coins
existed back then.
However, a medrash about Hashem pointing to the image of a coin to
explain that the mitzvah of machatzis hasheqel must be a coin implies
Chazal did consider the din miSinai.
(Regardless of questions of the historicity of a given midrashic
narrative, it wouldn't make sense to tell a story that depends on Hashem
giving Moshe a din derabbanan.)
I didn't think the point was important enough to warrant a fuller
explanation, but aside from Zev's post, others asked me off-list.
GCT!
-Micha
--
Micha Berger We are what we repeatedly do.
http://www.aishdas.org/asp Thus excellence is not an event,
Author: Widen Your Tent but a habit.
- https://amzn.to/2JRxnDF - Aristotle
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Message: 7
From: Micha Berger
Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2022 10:40:10 -0400
Subject: Re: [Avodah] Proteksia
On Tue, Sep 20, 2022 at 04:19:51PM -0400, Joel Rich via Avodah wrote:
> Your thoughts on the halachic appropriateness of this post which was on a
> community list?
>> A good friend had a bad fall, and was approved to get into xxxx rehab
>> after her surgery-but needs to wait for an available bed
>> Does anyone have proteksia- someone who might be able to make this happen
>> ASAP?
Aniyei irekha qodmin (which halakhah generalizes to family first, etc...)
will set people from different cities at odds with each other's goals.
This seems of a piece.
GCT!
-Micha
--
Micha Berger A person must be very patient
http://www.aishdas.org/asp even with himself.
Author: Widen Your Tent - attributed to R' Nachman of Breslov
- https://amzn.to/2JRxnDF
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Message: 8
From: Micha Berger
Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2022 10:38:04 -0400
Subject: Re: [Avodah] eulogy?
On Thu, Sep 29, 2022 at 09:23:20AM -0400, Joel Rich via Avodah wrote:
> The gemara (Sanhedrin 47a) says it's a good sign for the departed if they
> are not properly eulogized (apparently it's a "punishment"). If so, why
> don't we see more people requesting they not be eulogized?
Is it a good sign if it's orchestrated by the niftar, or only if
min hashamayim?
Seems moderately related:
I am reminded of the Or haChaim on throwing Yosef in a pit vs
killing him outright. Once someone's free will has to be accomodated,
hashgachah may not be absolute. (Or, one could say: it is absolute,
and part of what H' works out to happen is respecting bechirah
chofshi.)
GCT!
-Micha
--
Micha Berger It's nice to be smart,
http://www.aishdas.org/asp but it's smarter to be nice.
Author: Widen Your Tent - R' Lazer Brody
- https://amzn.to/2JRxnDF
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Message: 9
From: Joel Rich
Date: Wed, 28 Sep 2022 09:14:22 -0400
Subject: [Avodah] Something to Think About Before Yom Kippur
"In truth, however, it is to God alone that man is to feel
Subservient. The Toran teaches us, for example, to love and cherish
our children. At the same time, the story of the Akeidah demonstrates
that parental love is not an absolute value. Whether it be family,
friends, the government- we must not pledge absolute loyalty to any
of them. It is prohibited to subjugate oneself to any power of cause
other than the Master of the universe." (On Repentance, p. 142 )
KVCT
Joel Rich
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Message: 10
From: Prof. L. Levine
Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2022 21:05:23 +0000
Subject: [Avodah] Pie Crusts, Pas Palter, and the Aseres Yemei Teshuva
The following are excerpts from https://ohr.edu/this_week/insights_into_halacha/4893
A neighborhood housewife recently asked if I would be able to help her
understand why some of her relatives did not partake of her dessert
specialty, pareve ice cream pie, on the previous Shabbos. I asked her if
the pie crust was Pas Yisrael. She said it was not, but as far as she knew,
these relatives were not stringent with that halacha,rather relying on the
common leniencies (see below). I explained to her that even so, Shabbos
changes everything! But, to properly understand why, some background is in
order.
A neighborhood housewife recently asked if I would be able to help her
understand why some of her relatives did not partake of her dessert
specialty, pareve ice cream pie, on the previous Shabbos. I asked her if
the pie crust was Pas Yisrael. She said it was not, but as far as she knew,
these relatives were not stringent with that halacha,rather relying on the
common leniencies (see below). I explained to her that even so, Shabbos
changes everything! But, to properly understand why, some background is in
order.
<Snip>
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Message: 11
From: Prof. L. Levine
Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2022 21:14:57 +0000
Subject: [Avodah] I will be traveling during that time and will be in
From today's OU Kosher Halacha Yomis
Q. There is a custom to only eat Pas Yisroel (bread baked with the
involvement of a Yisroel) during Aseres Yemei Teshuva (the ten days from
Rosh Hashanah to Yom Kippur). I will be traveling during that time and will
be in an area where Pas Yisroel is not available. What should I do?
A. Shulchan Aruch (112:2) writes that if Pas Yisroel is not available, one
may be lenient to purchase pas palter (bread baked by a non-Jewish baker).
Mishnah Berurah (603:1) writes that this leniency applies even during the
Aseres Yemei Teshuva, when the minhag is to eat only Pas Yisroel. However,
if Pas Yisroel becomes available during the Aseres Yemei Teshuva, one
should stop eating pas palter and eat only Pas Yisroel. Which foods are
included in the category of Pas Yisroel? The word ?pas? literally means
bread. However, many poskim (e.g., Taz, Pri Chadash, Beis Meir) explain
that with regard to Pas Yisroel, the definition of bread is any pastry that
would become hamotzi if one was koveya seuda (i.e., if it was used as the
staple of a meal). Therefore, pas haba?ah b?kisnin (e.g., cookies, cakes,
crackers) is included in the category of Pas Yisroel.
YL
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