Avodah Mailing List

Volume 38: Number 100

Tue, 24 Nov 2020

• 1. Barely a Minyan in COVID Times (Prof. L. Levine)
• 2. Re: Pushing Off the Upsherin (Rich, Joel)
• 3. Re: ad hayom hazeh (Rich, Joel)
• 4. Lag Ba'omer Upsherins and the sources of customs (Prof. L. Levine)
• 5. Special Places (Micha Berger)
• 6. Re: Special Places (Micha Berger)

In response to my email earlier today regarding the article at
https://vosizneias.com/2020/11/17/barely-a-minyan-in-covid-times/
Rabbi Dr. Ari Zivotofsky sent me the following
> See this article text and note 4:
> https://outorah.org/p/5704/

[By RAZZ. It begins:  -micha]
> Tzarich Iyun: Davening with a Minyan

> Misconception:The main purpose of davening (praying) with a minyan is
> to be able to recite devarim shebekedushah (prayers with the status of
> sanctity), such as Kaddish, Kedushah and Barchu.

> Fact: There are many advantages to davening in shul with a minyan:
> creating community; davening slower and with more kavanah (concentration);
> responding to Kaddish, et cetera, and hearing the Torah reading. But
> the main halachic goal of praying with a minyan is to say Shemoneh Esrei
> simultaneously with a quorum -- which is the technical definition of tefillah
> betzibbur (communal prayer).

See the rest of the article at the above URL.

The footnotes are listed in one long paragraph form.

> 
> Yes it is! And isn't that exactly how minhagim are *supposed* to work?
> 
> Once upon a time, the traditionalists said Birchos Krias Shema exactly
> as had been done for centuries. And along came the innovators,
> introducing their Piyutim. Now, the traditionalists want to continue
> saying their Piyutim, and the innovators are more sensitive to the
> problems of Hefsek.
> 
> Is one more correct than the other? Some say things must never change,
> and others say it is natural and normal. I prefer the middle road,
> where changes come slowly and carefully, and under the guidance of our
> leaders.
> 
//////:::::::
I think this is an interesting historical question as well.one often sees
In halachic sources the phrase ubzmaneinu The practice has changed. I
always wonder why and how. My guess is that it?s a delicate dance between
the laity and rabbinic leader ship.
Kt
Joel RichTHIS MESSAGE IS INTENDED ONLY FOR THE USE OF THE 
ADDRESSEE.  IT MAY CONTAIN PRIVILEGED OR CONFIDENTIAL 
INFORMATION THAT IS EXEMPT FROM DISCLOSURE.  Dissemination, 
distribution or copying of this message by anyone other than the addressee is 
strictly prohibited.  If you received this message in error, please notify us 
immediately by replying: "Received in error" and delete the message.  
Thank you.

> Does the latter interpretation mean that some avenues of free will
> are foreclosed? According to the former, why bother telling us?

Let me give a mashal from Widen Your Tent sec. 2.5 (I agree with the
author on this point):

    When you drop a drop of ink into a cup of water, the ink spirals
    around in some chaotic pattern and eventually diffuses until the
    entire liquid is a uniform light blue. Even though each time you
    repeat the experiment the dance and spiral are different, something
    about the process in general is predictable. If you had different
    snapshots of the sequence that were significantly far enough apart
    in time, you could place them in historical order. Entropy always
    increases until it reaches the maximum. The system runs a certain way,
    reaching equilibrium.
-------------------------------------
Yes, but theoretically if each individual made decisions that in total did
not get to the desired end state, doesn't this imply that HKBH would have
to limit someone's bechira to reach the end state?
KT
Joel Rich
THIS MESSAGE IS INTENDED ONLY FOR THE USE OF THE 
ADDRESSEE.  IT MAY CONTAIN PRIVILEGED OR CONFIDENTIAL 
INFORMATION THAT IS EXEMPT FROM DISCLOSURE.  Dissemination, 
distribution or copying of this message by anyone other than the addressee is 
strictly prohibited.  If you received this message in error, please notify us 
immediately by replying: "Received in error" and delete the message.  
Thank you.

Please see https://www.academia.edu/12271408/Lag_Baomer_Upsherins_and_the_sources_of_customs?email_work_card=view-paper
to download this article.

From the article

Another minhag that takes place at the
kever of Rashbi on Lag Ba?Omer is the upsherin.
Rabbi Binyamin Shlomo Hamberger
(Shorshei Minhag Ashkenaz 3:251-67) writes
that there are several reasons to doubt that
it is an old minhag, as there is no mention
of this custom in any of the Rishonim. Furthermore,
he shows that in the times of the
Rishonim they cut a child?s hair long before
the child was three years old.

An early source given for the upsherin
custom is the Arizal, in the passage quoted,
where it is claimed that the reason the
Arizal traveled to Rashbi?s kever on Lag
Ba?Omer was to give his son an upsherin.
However, Rabbi Hamberger and others
point out this attribution is problematic as
it is documented that the Arizal did not
cut hair during the entire Sefirah?including
Lag Ba?Omer. The second researcher
says that this question could be resolved
by saying that what the Ari did to his son,
and what he himself did were two different
things. Another possible solution
could be that this story took place prior
involved in Kabbalah.

An early source for upsherin can be
found in the Radvaz (2:608), but the upsherin
was done at the kever of Shmuel
Hanavi not at Rashbi?s kever. This would
support the theory of the first researcher
mentioned earlier that the minhagim of
Lag Ba?Omer stemmed from the celebrations
at the kever of Shmuel Hanavi.
to the time that the Arizal began to be involved
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.aishdas.org/pipermail/avodah-aishdas.org/attachments/20201122/b590f990/attachment-0001.html>

One of the more quoted thoughts of the Meshekh Chokhmah is his idea
that there is no such thing as inherent qedushah. Qedushah is caused
by human activity. RYMhK brings this a few times, one is on parashas
Bo <https://www.sefaria.org/Meshech_Hochma%2C_Bo.46>

He goes as far as to say that thinking that an object or place can be
inherently holy is already the beginning of AZ!

So I was wondering what the MC would do with Yaaqov's statements in
this week's parashah "akhein yeish H' bamaqom hazzah... mah nora hamaqom
hazeh..." (Bereishis 28:16-17)

But his comments here have to do more with explaining it in light of
Hashem's statement at the seneh, "ushemi H' lo nodati lahem".

Does he discuss why Moriah is different anywhere? Is it Avraham and
Yitzchaq's tefillos there that Yaaqov didn't even know about that made
his nevu'ah more possible? Kind of robs the original statement of most
of its rationalism. I also don't think it fits how the MC explains why
bayis sheini is qidshah le'asid lavo which is specifically because we
DIDN'T forget bayis sheini!

Tir'u baTov!
-Micha

-- 
Micha Berger                 The purely righteous do not complain about evil,
http://www.aishdas.org/asp   but add justice, don't complain about heresy,
Author: Widen Your Tent      but add faith, don't complain about ignorance,
- https://amzn.to/2JRxnDF    but add wisdom.     - R AY Kook, Arpelei Tohar

On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 04:41:03PM -0500, Micha Berger via Avodah wrote:
> Does he discuss why Moriah is different anywhere? Is it Avraham and
> Yitzchaq's tefillos there that Yaaqov didn't even know about that made
> his nevu'ah more possible? Kind of robs the original statement of most
> of its rationalism. I also don't think it fits how the MC explains why
> bayis sheini is qidshah le'asid lavo which is specifically because we
> DIDN'T forget bayis sheini!

Oy, I messed that up. This presumes Har haMoriah was moved to Beis-El.

I don't think the MC's shitah even has that to fall back on. So, how
does Beis-El (a/k/a Luz) qualify as a "beis E-lokim / sha'ar hashamayim"?

Tir'u baTov!
-Micha


------------------------------



_______________________________________________
Avodah mailing list
Avo...@lists.aishdas.org
http://www.aishdas.org/lists/avodah
http://lists.aishdas.org/listinfo.cgi/avodah-aishdas.org


------------------------------


***************************************

Send Avodah mailing list submissions to
	avodah@lists.aishdas.org

To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
	http://www.aishdas.org/lists/avodah/avodahareivim-membership-agreement/


You can reach the person managing the list at
	avodah-owner@lists.aishdas.org


When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Avodah digest..."

A list of common acronyms is available at
        http://www.aishdas.org/lists/avodah/avodah-acronyms
(They are also visible in the web archive copy of each digest.)