Volume 34: Number 79
Tue, 12 Jul 2016
Subjects Discussed In This Issue:
Message: 1
From: Professor L. Levine
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2016 16:12:07 +0000
Subject: [Avodah] Birkas Kohanim and You
From
http://ohr.edu/this_week/insights_into_halacha/4925
Note the reference to followers of Shabtai Zvi below.
Unsuccessful in Chu"l
In Chutz La'aretz, although many Sefardic congregations do indeed Duchen
every day[2]<http://ohr.edu/4925#_edn2>, on the
other hand, among Ashkenazic Kehillos, this unique service is relegated to
Mussaf on Yom Tov as per the Rema's ruling (Orach Chaim 128, 44)[3]<http://ohr.edu/4925#_edn3>.
It is well known that many Gedolim including the Vilna Gaon, the Shulchan
Aruch HaRav, Rav Chaim Volozhiner, the Netziv, and Rav Nosson Adler tried
unsuccessfully to reinstate the minhag to perform Birkas Kohanim in
Ashkenazic Kehillos on a daily basis[4]<http://ohr.edu/4925#_edn4>. The
Aruch Hashulchan states that it is as if a Heavenly voice proclaimed not to
do Birkas Kohanim on a daily basis outside of Eretz Yisrael and considers
it a Decree from Above. In fact, the Beis Efraim[5]<http://ohr.edu/4925#_edn5>
vigorously defends the common practice in Chutz La'aretz not to duchen
daily, and maintains that it is an ancient custom as well, dating back to
the Maharam m'Rottenberg, and is a minhag kavua that can not be changed. He
cites many proofs to this and questions the validity of duchening daily,
even in Eretz Yisrael. He adds an interesting note from Rav Yaakov
Sasportas that one of the minhagim that the followers of the false messiah
Shabtai Zvi practiced was to duchen d
aily. Come what may, not duchening in Chutz La'aretz on a daily basis has since become standard Ashkenazic practice.
On the other hand, in most parts of Eretz Yisrael[6]<http://ohr.edu/4925#_edn6>, and
especially in Yerushalayim, we (Ashkenazim included!) are fortunate to be
able to receive this unique bracha every day, and on Shabbos and Yom Tov
(and on fast days!) even more than once.
See the above URL for more.
YL
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Message: 2
From: Rich, Joel
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2016 15:40:08 +0000
Subject: Re: [Avodah] RHS on shabbat - electricity
> On 07/12/2016 07:11 AM, Rich, Joel via Avodah wrote:
>> Usually he mentions the position of the shut harambam which clearly
>> states that it is prohibited to set in motion prior to Shabbat
> Which teshuvah is this and where can I find it?
My bad - it's actually a ktav yad:
????? ????"? ????? ??? (???? ??- ??? ??? ?')
Peirush haRambam leMeseches Shabbos (Kesav Yad, sof pereq 1)
[transliteration mine -micha]
KT
Joel Rich
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Message: 3
From: Zev Sero
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2016 11:57:28 -0400
Subject: Re: [Avodah] RHS on shabbat - electricity
On 07/12/2016 11:40 AM, Rich, Joel wrote:
> My bad - it's actually a ktav yad:
> ????? ????"? ????? ??? (???? ??- ??? ??? ?')
> Peirush haRambam leMeseches Shabbos (Kesav Yad, sof pereq 1)
If this is a reference to the Kafih edition of Perush Hamishnayos,
I can't find where he says this. (And if there's a substantive
difference between his translation and ibn Tibbon's I'd have expected
to see a footnote about it, but I didn't find one.)
--
Zev Sero Meaningless combinations of words do not acquire
z...@sero.name meaning merely by appending them to the two other
words `God can'. Nonsense remains nonsense, even
when we talk it about God. -- C S Lewis
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Message: 4
From: Rich, Joel
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2016 15:59:39 +0000
Subject: Re: [Avodah] RHS on shabbat - electricity
>> it's actually a ktav yad: ????? ????"? ????? ??? (???? ??- ??? ??? ?')
>> Peirush haRambam leMeseches Shabbos (Kesav Yad, sof pereq 1)
> If this is a reference to the Kafih edition of Perush Hamishnayos,
> I can't find where he says this. (And if there's a substantive
> difference between his translation and ibn Tibbon's I'd have expected
> to see a footnote about it, but I didn't find one.)
This is all I have on it as quoted from Rav Schachter - Perhaps someone
can ask him for more detail
KT
Joel Rich
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Message: 5
From: Marty Bluke
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2016 12:50:12 -0400
Subject: [Avodah] RHS on shabbat - electricity
Did he discuss the status of electronic water meters on shabbos? This is a
hot topic in Israel because they are being installed all over.
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Message: 6
From: Micha Berger
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2016 13:15:24 -0400
Subject: Re: [Avodah] RHS on shabbat - electricity
On Tue, Jul 12, 2016 at 12:50:12PM -0400, Marty Bluke via Avodah wrote:
: Did he discuss the status of electronic water meters on shabbos? This is a
: hot topic in Israel because they are being installed all over.
You might wish to look at the thread "If you have an electronic water
meter, can you turn on your faucet on Shabbos?" (split among at least
three adjacent subject lines) at <http://j.mp/14gTQhq> or
http://www.aishdas.org/avoda
h/getindex.cgi?section=I#IF%20YOU%20HAVE%20AN%20ELECTRONIC%20WATER%20METER%
20CAN%20YOU
It was launched in July 2012, by one R' Marty Bluke. RHS's position was
not included, as far as I can tell. But we got quite a distance on pesiq
reishei delo nicha lei and delo echpas lei.
The consensus was "lo nicha lei" (IMHO) as we would prefer not being
billed, just as we wouldn't stop using the water if the meter were broken
and couldn't bill us.
So then it's a question of pesiq reishei delo nicha lei on a derabbanan,
a machloqes between the Trumas haDeshen and the MA (314:1).
Tir'u baTov!
-Micha
--
Micha Berger When faced with a decision ask yourself,
mi...@aishdas.org "How would I decide if it were Ne'ilah now,
http://www.aishdas.org at the closing moments of Yom Kippur?"
Fax: (270) 514-1507 - Rav Yisrael Salanter
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Message: 7
From: Ben Waxman
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2016 22:27:45 +0200
Subject: Re: [Avodah] leviim on duty
I thought that they did their shmirah outside of the Temple Mount.
Plus, who exactly are they going to tell not go up? The goyim or
secular? The Dati Jews who do go prepare themselves?
Ben
On 7/8/2016 10:27 PM, saul newman via Avodah wrote:
> in my notes i found 2 reasons why leviim don't currently stand guard
> duty at Har Habayit. one, jews don't control the area.
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Message: 8
From: Eli Turkel
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2016 21:59:57 +0300
Subject: [Avodah] derabbanan
<<IOW, if there is no chiyuv de'oraisa to resist tei'avon to obey a
derabbanan, then how could the chakhamim create the meta-chiyuv in a
way that we would be duty-bound to obey? The meta-chuyuv too is versus
to'eivah, not rebellion. >>
R Avraham's main thesis is that whenever we are stumped by a dichotomy the
only way out is to find some middle ground. In our case there are two ways
of learning from a pasukh
1) the case of interest is a detail of the pasuk (hitpartot) in which case
it is a deoraisa
2) asmachta which makes it a derabbanan
Basically, Micha's question is that whichever we choose for "lo tasur" we
are in trouble.
RMA's answer is that there is a third possibility what he calls his-taa-fut
- branching out.
This is something that comes from the pasuk but indirectly.
He gives the example of a neder. The Torah says one must keep a neder.
However, it is the human that decides exactly what the neder says.
This third possibility is in between the first possibilities. This "branch"
comes from the pasuk "to tasur" but creates a derabban and not a deoraisa.
Someone who violates a derabbanan has not violated a torah prohibition.
RMA also pointed out that the Ritva claims that there are two kinds of
asmachta. One is just a device for memory and is a pure derabbanan. However
there is a second asmachta which is really hinted at by the pasuk.
Nevertheless it has a status of a rabbinic law.
RMA the claims that both the Rambam and Ramban agree to this even though
they seem to disagree. He the goes another step and says that nevertheless
they have a disagreement. Rambam holds that chazal are representatives of
G-d. However the Ramban disagrees as sees chazal as "shiluche didan" and we
must listen to chazal as a natural extension that we accepted on ourselves
this covers about 100 pages out of 500 in his book!!
--
Eli Turkel
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Message: 9
From: Zev Sero
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2016 15:56:01 -0400
Subject: Re: [Avodah] leviim on duty
On 07/12/2016 04:27 PM, Ben Waxman via Avodah wrote:
> On 7/8/2016 10:27 PM, saul newman via Avodah wrote:
>> in my notes i found 2 reasons why leviim don't currently stand
>> guard duty at Har Habayit. one, jews don't control the area.
> I thought that they did their shmirah outside of the Temple Mount.
No, outside the Mount what is there to guard? The first mishnos of
Tamid and Middos say that "Kohanim guard in three places, and Leviyim
in twenty-one", and all those places are on the Mount.
> Plus, who exactly are they going to tell not go up? The goyim or
> secular? The Dati Jews who do go prepare themselves?
The guards are not supposed to tell anyone anything. They're supposed
to stand there, just like those men with the funny hats outside Buck House.
(Though not with such tough discipline; the gemara makes it clear that
they're allowed to sit, and to talk to each other.)
--
Zev Sero Meaningless combinations of words do not acquire
z...@sero.name meaning merely by appending them to the two other
words `God can'. Nonsense remains nonsense, even
when we talk it about God. -- C S Lewis
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Message: 10
From: saul newman
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2016 13:35:55 -0700
Subject: [Avodah] kedusha of non-O paraphenalia
http:
//forward.com/news/344480/watch-ultra-orthodox-rip-up-prayer-book-to-protes
t-western-wall-bat-mitzvah/?attribution=our-picks-2-title
the commentors here have a fairly viscious back and forth. but regardless
of the propriety of ripping up the WoW's books from a social standpoint ,
isn't it clear halachically that the prayer books have no kedusha , nor
other seforim even if the Shem is in them?
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Message: 11
From: saul newman
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2016 13:41:36 -0700
Subject: [Avodah] RHS on shabbat
Overriding the switch is against American law and so prohibited by dina
demalchuta.
---overriding what switch is this referring to?
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Message: 12
From: Micha Berger
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2016 17:00:47 -0400
Subject: Re: [Avodah] leviim on duty
On Tue, Jul 12, 2016 at 10:27:45PM +0200, Ben Waxman via Avodah wrote:
: Plus, who exactly are they going to tell not go up? The goyim or
: secular? The Dati Jews who do go prepare themselves?
The beefeaters in full dress outside Buckingham Palace are not really
the ones keeping the royal family safe. Their guard duty is part of the
honor one shows royalty.
The Mechilta, the Rambam (Beis haBachirach 8:1), the Chinukh and others
explain shemiras hamiqdash (Rambam asei #22, lav #67) similarly. Quoting
Seifar haMitzvos quoting the Mechilta, "ve'ino domeh palterin sheyeish
alav shomerim, lepalterei she'ein alav shomeim".
Tir'u baTov!
-Micha
--
Micha Berger Brains to the lazy
mi...@aishdas.org are like a torch to the blind --
http://www.aishdas.org a useless burden.
Fax: (270) 514-1507 - Bechinas haOlam
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Message: 13
From: Micha Berger
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2016 17:07:18 -0400
Subject: Re: [Avodah] kedusha of non-O paraphenalia
On Tue, Jul 12, 2016 at 01:35:55PM -0700, saul newman via Avodah wrote:
: http://forward.com/news/344480/w
: atch-ultra-orthodox-rip-up-prayer-book-to-protest-western-wall-bat-mitzva
: h
:
: the commentors here have a fairly viscious back and forth. but regardless
: of the propriety of ripping up the WoW's books from a social standpoint ,
: isn't it clear halachically that the prayer books have no kedusha ...
What are they? Modified sedurim, or traditional sedurim WoW happen to own?
If an apiqoreis writes a seifer Torah, it has no qedushah. But if an
apiqoreis buys a kosher seifer Torah, does it lose its qedushah?
And what if it's not an apiqoreis, but a tinoq shenishba (many of the WoW
are not from O homes) or a mumar letei'avon (honestly mislefd by a desire
for egalitarianism)? Or even a mumar lehach'is, but on a din derabbanan?
Even granted that WoW are sinning (and I fear I will get flack from some
long-time members for assuming as much) not every sin is heresy.
Tir'u baTov!
-Micha
--
Micha Berger It's never too late
mi...@aishdas.org to become the person
http://www.aishdas.org you might have been.
Fax: (270) 514-1507 - George Eliot
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Message: 14
From: Simon Montagu
Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2016 00:26:44 +0300
Subject: Re: [Avodah] RHS on shabbat
On Tue, Jul 12, 2016 at 11:41 PM, saul newman via Avodah <
avo...@lists.aishdas.org> wrote:
> Overriding the switch is against American law and so prohibited by dina
> demalchuta.
>
> ---overriding what switch is this referring to?
>
Presumably the switch that makes the dishwasher cut off when the door is
opened. But I find this surprising: I understand such a law applying to
people *selling* dishwashers, but is it really illegal to modify an
appliance which is your property and you use in your own home?
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